BH209 in Plunger models.

BH209 in Plunger models.

Postby KnightMl » February 22nd, 2012, 7:11 pm

Ok so who has some success with this?

I have a much older 209 kit that I am using with BH209. Its fully enclosed like the pics at BH209 has on their website.

I get 100% reliable ignition with mine. But accuracy is sub par compared to my pyrodex loads. By sub par I mean 1.5 to 2.00 inch groups at 100 yards.

Nothing to sneeze at but my pryodex loads will get me below MOA.

Just wondering if anyone is doing something different to get better consistancy????
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Re: BH209 in Plunger models.

Postby frontstuffer01 » February 22nd, 2012, 8:13 pm

Need to be very careful shooting blackhorn 209 out of a plunger style mz.......i tried that on a plunger style an part of the 209 blew apart and came very close to hitting me in my eye, needless to say i won't be using anymore 209 in any of my plunger style mz........you may want to try a different sabot with the bullet your using, maybe a mmp, harvester crush rib, etc...........btw how many grains are you shooting.
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Re: BH209 in Plunger models.

Postby bigbullelk » February 22nd, 2012, 8:17 pm

u need 2 shoot what shoots best out of your gun. I shoot Blackhorn and am very happy with it. I shoot 100gr with a 250gr Barnes bullet. I also have very good luck with PR QT bullets. Some muzzleloaders can b very finicky. Sounds like yours love pyrodex.
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Re: BH209 in Plunger models.

Postby sabotloader » February 22nd, 2012, 11:34 pm

KnightMl

You really need to be carefull shooting 209 primers from any plunger type gun especially bare primers.

When Western suggests a closed breech they are really suggestion a closed and sealed breech area.

Plunger gun will allow blow back gases to push the plunger back, ejecting the primer or parts of the primer from the breech plug. Having the hammer/plunger in a closure sure helps reduce the hazard but it also reduces the effectivness of BH-209. BH is a smokeless progressive burning powder and relies on a pressure curve to be effecient and accurate shot to shot. A leaky plunger will reduce both accuracy and effieciency.

This a group of pictures showing the results of shooting a plunger gun with a bare 209 and with a heavy bullets and 100 grains of T7 in a MK.

Image
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Re: BH209 in Plunger models.

Postby KnightMl » February 23rd, 2012, 6:29 pm

frontstuffer01 wrote:Need to be very careful shooting blackhorn 209 out of a plunger style mz.......i tried that on a plunger style an part of the 209 blew apart and came very close to hitting me in my eye, needless to say i won't be using anymore 209 in any of my plunger style mz........you may want to try a different sabot with the bullet your using, maybe a mmp, harvester crush rib, etc...........btw how many grains are you shooting.


I am just shooting 80 grains right now and don't intend on going up any. Also just shooting the 250 grain pills. Do not want to have any more pressure to deal with.
I went with the CCI 209 primers in my kit and have not had them fragment on me yet with those low doses. Ive not tried the Winchester primers but I am told they are not as hard and may fragment eaiser.
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Re: BH209 in Plunger models.

Postby sabotloader » February 23rd, 2012, 6:56 pm

KnightMl wrote:
frontstuffer01 wrote:Need to be very careful shooting blackhorn 209 out of a plunger style mz.......i tried that on a plunger style an part of the 209 blew apart and came very close to hitting me in my eye, needless to say i won't be using anymore 209 in any of my plunger style mz........you may want to try a different sabot with the bullet your using, maybe a mmp, harvester crush rib, etc...........btw how many grains are you shooting.


I am just shooting 80 grains right now and don't intend on going up any. Also just shooting the 250 grain pills. Do not want to have any more pressure to deal with.
I went with the CCI 209 primers in my kit and have not had them fragment on me yet with those low doses. Ive not tried the Winchester primers but I am told they are not as hard and may fragment eaiser.


The 80-250 grain combination in most instances will probably never cause you any primer problems, no matter which primer you might be using. I do not know if you are shooting this combination in a Knight or not, but if you were, you actually could get better performance from BH with a FPJ system vs. a NFPJ... The FPJ may retain the breech pressure better or longer than a bare primer pushing on a planger/hammer.

I think I mentioned the 'progressive burning' nature of BH and maintaining consistent pressure is really esssential to maintaining accuracy.
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Re: BH209 in Plunger models.

Postby frontstuffer01 » February 23rd, 2012, 9:33 pm

Agreed with Sabotloader..........but me personally, i have noticed the better accuracy with the bare 209 primer vs the plastic jacket with either blackhorn 209 or pyrodex,......gonna get some of the alliant mz powder an see how that does.
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Re: BH209 in Plunger models.

Postby cayugad » February 26th, 2012, 4:54 pm

All I will do is add my two cents. I tried BlackHorn 209 when it first came out. I shot it in a T/C Black Diamond XR and a CVA Staghorn Magnum. I shot four rounds of 80 grains out of the CVA and had no problems. So being sure of myself, I loaded the Black Diamond XR and tried 100 grains (since this rifle likes a powerful load). The second shot delivered a chunk of the 209 primer into my forehead. With a mirror and a thumbnail I was able to dig it out. And that was the last BlackHorn I ever shot out of a plunger style rifle. I still shoot BlackHorn 209 out of my Genesis and my Knight Disc with excellent results.. now that I went to a very hot primer.

If you insist on shooting the BlackHorn 209 out of your plunger gun, do yourself a favor and invest in a pair of shooting glasses that will protect your eye. All that said, it is a wonderful powder to shoot, but IMO has its drawbacks as well.
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Re: BH209 in Plunger models.

Postby cayugad » March 25th, 2012, 6:34 pm

All I can comment to.. and this was not with a Knight, but I was shooting BlackHorn 209 in a plunger style rifle. I fired two rounds just fine. The third time I was digging a chunk of primer out of my forehead, above the eye brow. After that, I had no desire to shoot blackhorn out of a plunger gun. Besides, it works so great in my Knight Disc.. why mess with what works.

In my Knight LK rifles I shoot Black Powder. Because of their short barrels and #11 ignition I limit them to about 90 grains of powder tops. Accuracy is exceptional, and clean up is no harder then it would have been with BlackHorn 209.
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